I would say Lolas bits never went back to the same as before but certainly not as big as to look like testicles :? Her nipples also remain bigger

 

I'm no expert but she could just be going through a bit of a phantam . If she's happy well showing no signs of ill health I'd wait and see I have a bitch no without fail goes through it right up to the point of labor different dogs go through varying degrees think it comes from the alpha bitch has the puppies then when the pack go off to hunt the others go through phantam to produce milk and nurse the pups or something like that

 

I thought Phantum but isn't it a bit late now? Also, there are no other symptoms of Phantum from her.

 

My old girl Jet used to get phantoms approximately 7 to 8 weeks after her season finished. In her case her bits and nipples became swollen and she produced milk so long as there is no sign of infection - let mother nature take its course was our vets advise.
She may also nest a little - carrying her soft toys around and laying on them.

It is worth noting that if she has had one phantom pregnancy she is likely to have them after each season - it may be worth considering getting her spayed.

My new girl Ellie will be spayed after her first season as we don't want to breed or show her.

 

She is a lady now, not a little girl, and she will never go back to her original baby size. (Although saying that, the vulva often shrinks a little after spaying.)

Regards, John

 

Hmmm 7 or 8 weeks that would be around now! Ok so what other signs should I look for apart from those already mentioned?

 

I would have thought (and I am no expert on this so don't know if a phantom pregnancy is a possibility with these symptoms) that surely the phantom pregnancy would be progress up to a climax of 8 weeks after the ovulation date during the season, as this is when puppies would be born, so I would have thought, it could go on that long.

 

http://www.labradorforums.co.uk/ftopict-82926-phantom.html+pregnancy


Have a look through this thread as it will give some ideas as to signs to look out for. The first phantom Jet had caught us by surprise and it was sticky milky discharge that gave it away - trip to the vet confirmed phantom with infected teats so she was given antibiotics and something to dry up the milk she was also checked for pyometra which turned out negative.

After that we knew what to expect and further phantoms required no vet treatments.

Good Luck

 

My friends Am bulldog X's Vulva is HUGE, and has remained so after her first season, with some dogs that's how it is.

If there is no infection, her nipples are normal as JohnW says nothing to worry about :wink:

 

Signs of an infection could be any of the following: discharge, lack of appetite, drinking more, temperature, generally being quiet or uncomfortable, vomiting, diarrhoea. If you are concerned about any of these symptoms ring your vet immediately explaining the symptoms and that she is x weeks post season.

If you are still concerned in another couple of weeks it might be worth seeing the vet just to make sure all is in order.

 

Im going to keep an eye on her. Our male Dog keeps sniffing and licking her. Not sure if thats a good or bad sign. The interest started today.

 

Ok update .... She is bleeding. Could this be a season? I worked out its been 3 months since her first season....help ? Do I need to call a vet. BTW I now live in Switzerland so calling a vet today would cost 500 pound so hopefully you'll understand my caution at calling them first.

 

Are you 100% that it is coming from her vulva? (Wipe her vulva with a toilet tissue to check.) What colour is it? A nice clean red or a dirty brown?

Regards, John

 

Surely calling and asking for advice won't incur a fee will it? My vet (in France) has normal working hours on a Saturday.

If you're sure she had a season 3 months ago I think if it were me I'd be calling the vet for advice. It could be something more serious like open pyometra.

 

If you're sure she had a season 3 months ago I think if it were me I'd be calling the vet for advice. It could be something more serious like open pyometra.

She said earlier that the season was in April Nicola, when the bitch was 10 months old. So if the first season was 3 or even 4 months ago it's unlikely she is in season again. Split seasons can happen, but without giving drugs to stop the season the first time around they are as rare as hens teeth. Hence my question, "Are you sure the blood is from the vulva, check again." Also the colour question. Seasons start with quite a bright red bloody discharge, where a pyo tends to be more a dirty brown colour.

I have to say I'm a little concerned because the timing appears wrong.

Regards, John

 

If you think there is any chance that this could be pyometra you need to seek help as soon as possible because it can be fatal very quickly. If it is an infection then your insurance company will pay out. Direct Line paid for all Coco's pyometra treatment, spay, tests and aftercare - £657 in total.

Treatment for pyometra is usually an emergency spay operation (often within 24 hours) but if the dog isn't well enough she might be given a heavy dose of antibiotics for a couple of days first. The spay is a more delicate operation when the uterus is swollen and pus filled. Recovery can be a bit more difficult too as the dog is also recoving from a severe infection. Caught early there is a very good chance of recovery.

 

Ok I called the vet. He said that unless she is showing signs of distress its nothing to worry about and probably a season, apparently common in young dogs. She is well in herself, eating, alert and wanting to go for walks etc. The blood is red, as it was in her first season. Definately from her Vulva. I will be keeping a close eye on her and will call the vet ASAP.

 

He said that unless she is showing signs of distress its nothing to worry about and probably a season, apparently common in young dogs.

OK, For once I'll say it like it is. Something I dont do very often on here.

WHAT UTTER RUBBISH!

Yes a young dog can be a little variable with her seasons, but 10 months to the first and then the second before 14 months is not normal by anyone's book.

Can I ask you to read my post again and answer my questions, because although pyometra after the first season is unusual it is certainly not impossible and I can remember one on here a few years back.

Regards, John

 

John,

I know its a hard one to distrust the vet. I have the same feeling plus made worse being in a foreign country and not knowing the vet well. I have wiped her with a tissue and yes the blood is coming from her vulva....droplets in the house too.

This sounds silly but how brown does it have to be? Is it noticeable? The reason I ask is blood goes brown when it dries and some of her droplets were dry when I found them.

I'm going into serious panic mode now :-s. The vet said to contact them again on Monday.....god!!

 

Don't wait for it to dry, as I said, wipe with a toilet tissue and check the colour straight away.

Open pyo generally allows you more time than closed.

A friend of mine was worried because her bitch was drinking a lot and was also being sick several times, appeared lethargic. She phoned her vet late in the evening and was told, "It's probably just the hot weather, if you are still worried tomorrow bring her in." When she got up in the morning the bitch was dead! This was a closed pyo. But the thing about a closed pyo is that there is no discharge so the dog is very ill before anyone would know. With an open pyo, because there is a discharge you know earlier so have more time.

But the thing is, any time there is a discharge after a season it always sounds warning bells and any vet who ignored it is irresponsible. Yes, it's conceivable that it's the start of another season, but it's unlikely enough to need investigation. Being silly for a moment, are you sure you have the date of the last season right? Thinking back it's easy to think it's not as long ago as it really was? A month or so earlier would make it far more likely to be another season. Five to six months after would be much more likely.

Regards, John

 

Hi,

Regarding the dates of her season. I emailed her training school on 20th March saying she wouldn't be going. She bled for 2 weeks from that date and I would guess that she was fully out of it by mid April.

Those are the dates so its definately only 3ish months. Aaargh. OK I'm calling the vet again tomorrow.

BTW the blood is definately red. Is that a better sign?

 

I would count from the first day of her last season, that making 4.5 months. Far more likely to be another season than after 3 months. my bitch has a 5 month cycle . I would get her checked Monday morning to make sure if you are Absolutely certain blood is bright red and she is showing not the slightest sign of being unwell , even if she just seems off I would get her checked before, but if fine in herself, no excessive drinking, discharge bright red I would wait until Monday .

 

So after a sleepless night I got up this Morning and she is still bleeding. Bright red still so a good sign. Very sprightly and pretty much her normal self but a little needy. Will prob go to the vets Monday just to have her checked.

 

Just short of 5 months since her last season, sounds like she has come into season again

I just looked through Ruby's records and there was 5 months between her 1st and 2nd season as well

Fingers crossed that's what it is

 

It sounds like it could well be a very early second season and hopefully you will have nothing to worry about.

I only have my own experience to go by (and a few horror stories with worst case scenarios from other people). From my experience a dog doesn't have to look ill to be very ill indeed, they don't wallow in self misery like us humans do.

Coco came into season at 10.5 months (July 10th 2009) everything was normal and it was always my plan to have her spayed 3 months later in October/November. After her season her mamary glands grew (a phantom?) and she was a little quieter than usual but I put this down to her "growing up" and settling down a bit. In early October I took her to the vet with suspected mastitis because she looked a bit red around one of her teats.

Mid October I was concerned that she still was looking quite swollen and wasn't sure if the vet would spay her so I went to see them on Thursday 19th October to ask. At this point she was still enjoying walks, was eating and didn't really seem unwell. I mentioned that she had vomited once and when asked then I realised she had been drinking a bit more than usual, the vet examined her, discovered that she was producing milk, had a temperature and worse still had a discharge. I knew immediately that she was going to tell me it was pyometra. I also knew that my neighbour had lost 2 dogs to pyometra so I was terrified that I was going to lose her.

Coco was given an antibiotic injection and booked for spaying the following morning. However, a blood test the following day showed that her blood was lacking in white cells due to the infection and it wouldn't be safe to operate immediately as she may have clotting problems. She was put on antibiotics and sent home again. Another blood test the following monday was better and she was booked in for Tuesday.

She had her operation and made a good recovery, she has never looked back. And best of all, my insurance company paid for the operation so I only had to pay the excess to have her spayed.

We don't want to frighten you, but you do need to know what to look out for so that you can take action if necessary. Hopefully your girl is just having another season and will be fine.