Labradors Forums banner
1 - 4 of 4 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
2 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Can any one advise on best training leads for these two very head strong boys. We’ve tried figure of eight, halti no pull, ‘choke collar’ ( which I hate) they strangle themselves any advice welcome. We’ve had dogs all our lives from border terriers to border collies with no problems. When do they settle down a bit and start listening!!!
thank you
 

·
Administrator
Joined
·
21,397 Posts
There is only one way to get good work on the lead, and thats training. Sorry, no gimmick or latest gismo will do it for you. I have to say, you have made a rod for your back having two young pups at the same time. Were it me I would take them out separately until you have training sorted so you can concentrate on just one at a time. Even when I have a pup with an old dog I still train the pup separately. I put them both in my car, drive to the park, take the pup out first for her training session then put her back in my car while I go for a walk with my oldie. Below is a piece I wrote on heel training a while back.

Heel training seems to be the main stumbling block for most new puppy owners, yet there is no reason why it should be. But just looking on various dog forums there seems to be a common theme. HARNESSES! Everybody is looking for the holy grail in the latest harness, and are seduced by the silky language of the advertising agent who is paid to make their product seem the best thing since sliced bread. “Use my harness and your dog will never pull again!” and such things as “This harness is kind to your dog, unlike collars which are cruel and can cause untold damage!” What they never tell you is why your dog wont pull on their harness. So ask yourself? Question, Does your dog read the label and say, “Oh, this is a XYZ harness, we don’t pull these!” No of course they don’t. The reason why any harness works is because it inflicts pain somewhere on the dog so that it makes it painful to pull. The very thing they accused collars of doing! Think about this for a minute, THERE IS NO OTHER WAY THEY CAN WORK! But the main problem with seeking the holy grail of harnesses is that your training then lacks consistency. Every harness or collar works in a slightly different way, exerting pressure in a different place meaning there is no consistency in what you are doing. Dogs learn by repartition, but every time you change harnesses you are starting a new series of repartitions and your training starts from day one again. But you are not really training at all. All you are doing is using different things in the forlorn hope that you will bore your dog into submission and that he/she will eventually grow out of pulling. Then “Oh joy! This new harness really works! I’ll have to tell everybody about it!” No it didn’t. Your dog just grew tired of pulling! So, how do you actually TRAIN your dog heelwork?

First off, as in most things, there is more than one way to skin a cat. This is just my way.

Firstly, I never take a puppy for a walk. Every time we go out of the gate it’s training. But not too regimented, rather fun training. Think about this for a moment. You are going on the school run and take your pup with you, killing two birds with one stone. Kids to school and puppy walked! You are in a hurry as you always are at this time, trying to get the kids to school on time, and preferably with them not getting run over by a lorry on the way! You meet other mothers on the way and have a nice natter as you go. Once you have posted the kids in through the school gates you can relax and walk back home with the other mums. In all honesty pup did not get much of your attention for the whole of that time, you were too busy. Training the pup was the last thing on your mind! Yet your pup was learning. He was learning that there were exciting smells and sights just past the end of the lead, people to greet and to make a fuss of him, so he wanted to get there in a hurry. In other words, he was learning to pull you along!

Better to leave pup at home. A lesson learned by him that he cannot go everywhere you go! Take him out only when you can give him undivided attention. But I’m getting a bit in front of myself. Training starts the minute the pup arrives, well before it has had it’s vaccinations and able to go out.

The first part of training is to get the pup use to a collar, and this literally starts the day the pup arrives home. I always put the collar on immediately before feeding. That way the food takes the pup’s mind off the collar. I leave the collar on all the time unless pup is in her crate. (It has been known for collars to get caught up in the bars and strangle the pup, so don’t take chances!) I like the softest, lightest collar I can find.

My first actual heel training takes place off lead in the garden. Armed with a few treats I call the pup to my left side, waft the treat in front of his nose so that he is aware of it and with the command “Heel” walk forward 3 or 4 paces then stop, praise him and give him the treat, then give him my “End of training command.” In my case I use “OK” as the command. Basically it means “We’ve finished and you can do what you want now.” Talk to your pup while he’s walking at heel, tell him how wonderful he is, keep his attention on you.

After a few days of this, two or three times a day I’ll start using a lead. And for my first lead I use a piece of string! It’s lighter than any lead, which is ideal because I don’t want pup to really notice the “Lead.” We are starting to walk a little further now, so time to think about where to walk. Aim at 10 seconds of heelwork at first, keep it short and keep it fun. Walk pup on the left and If he tries to get in front turn in an anticlockwise direction across in front of him. If he lags behind turn clockwise away from him and encourage him up to heel. Never walk in a straight line for more than 5 paces, straight lines are boring! Squares, Triangles and circles are the order of the day. Add other exercises in to provide variation. Stays are so useful for when you need to clear something up on the floor, or even for taking photographs. Recalls are obviously useful. But don’t combine the exercises at this point. For example, if doing a sit stay then make sure you praise the sit stay before moving on to a recall. Make sure your pup KNOWS it’s finished it’s sit say!

There is a lot of talk about the relative merits of collars or harnesses. But in reality they only secure the dog from running off. Really they play very little part in the actual training. Because my pups are destine to be working gundogs I don’t want a collar on my dogs when working because of the risk of getting caught up and strangled. So I use a slip lead, so named because it is quick to slip on or off and does not need a collar! If you do your training right then you never have a tight lead so what you use is really unimportant.

So now the vaccinations have been given and your pup is able to go outside the gate. I slip my pup into my car and take her to the park where I can continue training along the route I’ve started. I don’t want to walk there because it’s too far to be able to keep my pup’s attention. Plenty of time for that when the habit of walking to heel is set. All the training in the park is the same as at home. Short pieces of work interspersed with games. Even sitting on a seat watching the world pass by is still training, it’s training patience! Work at your training and you will end up with a dog to be proud of. I don’t take my dogs for a walk. I go for a walk with my dogs, and thats a big difference.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2 Posts
Discussion Starter · #3 ·
There is only one way to get good work on the lead, and thats training. Sorry, no gimmick or latest gismo will do it for you. I have to say, you have made a rod for your back having two young pups at the same time. Were it me I would take them out separately until you have training sorted so you can concentrate on just one at a time. Even when I have a pup with an old dog I still train the pup separately. I put them both in my car, drive to the park, take the pup out first for her training session then put her back in my car while I go for a walk with my oldie. Below is a piece I wrote on heel training a while back.

Heel training seems to be the main stumbling block for most new puppy owners, yet there is no reason why it should be. But just looking on various dog forums there seems to be a common theme. HARNESSES! Everybody is looking for the holy grail in the latest harness, and are seduced by the silky language of the advertising agent who is paid to make their product seem the best thing since sliced bread. “Use my harness and your dog will never pull again!” and such things as “This harness is kind to your dog, unlike collars which are cruel and can cause untold damage!” What they never tell you is why your dog wont pull on their harness. So ask yourself? Question, Does your dog read the label and say, “Oh, this is a XYZ harness, we don’t pull these!” No of course they don’t. The reason why any harness works is because it inflicts pain somewhere on the dog so that it makes it painful to pull. The very thing they accused collars of doing! Think about this for a minute, THERE IS NO OTHER WAY THEY CAN WORK! But the main problem with seeking the holy grail of harnesses is that your training then lacks consistency. Every harness or collar works in a slightly different way, exerting pressure in a different place meaning there is no consistency in what you are doing. Dogs learn by repartition, but every time you change harnesses you are starting a new series of repartitions and your training starts from day one again. But you are not really training at all. All you are doing is using different things in the forlorn hope that you will bore your dog into submission and that he/she will eventually grow out of pulling. Then “Oh joy! This new harness really works! I’ll have to tell everybody about it!” No it didn’t. Your dog just grew tired of pulling! So, how do you actually TRAIN your dog heelwork?

First off, as in most things, there is more than one way to skin a cat. This is just my way.

Firstly, I never take a puppy for a walk. Every time we go out of the gate it’s training. But not too regimented, rather fun training. Think about this for a moment. You are going on the school run and take your pup with you, killing two birds with one stone. Kids to school and puppy walked! You are in a hurry as you always are at this time, trying to get the kids to school on time, and preferably with them not getting run over by a lorry on the way! You meet other mothers on the way and have a nice natter as you go. Once you have posted the kids in through the school gates you can relax and walk back home with the other mums. In all honesty pup did not get much of your attention for the whole of that time, you were too busy. Training the pup was the last thing on your mind! Yet your pup was learning. He was learning that there were exciting smells and sights just past the end of the lead, people to greet and to make a fuss of him, so he wanted to get there in a hurry. In other words, he was learning to pull you along!

Better to leave pup at home. A lesson learned by him that he cannot go everywhere you go! Take him out only when you can give him undivided attention. But I’m getting a bit in front of myself. Training starts the minute the pup arrives, well before it has had it’s vaccinations and able to go out.

The first part of training is to get the pup use to a collar, and this literally starts the day the pup arrives home. I always put the collar on immediately before feeding. That way the food takes the pup’s mind off the collar. I leave the collar on all the time unless pup is in her crate. (It has been known for collars to get caught up in the bars and strangle the pup, so don’t take chances!) I like the softest, lightest collar I can find.

My first actual heel training takes place off lead in the garden. Armed with a few treats I call the pup to my left side, waft the treat in front of his nose so that he is aware of it and with the command “Heel” walk forward 3 or 4 paces then stop, praise him and give him the treat, then give him my “End of training command.” In my case I use “OK” as the command. Basically it means “We’ve finished and you can do what you want now.” Talk to your pup while he’s walking at heel, tell him how wonderful he is, keep his attention on you.

After a few days of this, two or three times a day I’ll start using a lead. And for my first lead I use a piece of string! It’s lighter than any lead, which is ideal because I don’t want pup to really notice the “Lead.” We are starting to walk a little further now, so time to think about where to walk. Aim at 10 seconds of heelwork at first, keep it short and keep it fun. Walk pup on the left and If he tries to get in front turn in an anticlockwise direction across in front of him. If he lags behind turn clockwise away from him and encourage him up to heel. Never walk in a straight line for more than 5 paces, straight lines are boring! Squares, Triangles and circles are the order of the day. Add other exercises in to provide variation. Stays are so useful for when you need to clear something up on the floor, or even for taking photographs. Recalls are obviously useful. But don’t combine the exercises at this point. For example, if doing a sit stay then make sure you praise the sit stay before moving on to a recall. Make sure your pup KNOWS it’s finished it’s sit say!

There is a lot of talk about the relative merits of collars or harnesses. But in reality they only secure the dog from running off. Really they play very little part in the actual training. Because my pups are destine to be working gundogs I don’t want a collar on my dogs when working because of the risk of getting caught up and strangled. So I use a slip lead, so named because it is quick to slip on or off and does not need a collar! If you do your training right then you never have a tight lead so what you use is really unimportant.

So now the vaccinations have been given and your pup is able to go outside the gate. I slip my pup into my car and take her to the park where I can continue training along the route I’ve started. I don’t want to walk there because it’s too far to be able to keep my pup’s attention. Plenty of time for that when the habit of walking to heel is set. All the training in the park is the same as at home. Short pieces of work interspersed with games. Even sitting on a seat watching the world pass by is still training, it’s training patience! Work at your training and you will end up with a dog to be proud of. I don’t take my dogs for a walk. I go for a walk with my dogs, and thats a big difference.
Thank you. Yes we have been told many times it was a mistake but they were our pups so we’re hard to resist. So now we have to deal with that and I’m determined to do so. Thank you so much for your advice 😊
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
92 Posts
Thank you. Yes we have been told many times it was a mistake but they were our pups so we’re hard to resist. So now we have to deal with that and I’m determined to do so. Thank you so much for your advice 😊
Just wanted to offer encouragement, I am certainly learning the hard way with our girl Jas who is 8 months in a few days time. Everything John says is great advice, as you will know he has years of experience and his method of training comes from that. Unfortunately I'm still learning and Jas has fallen a little foul of that😀 All I would add is Consistency with a capital C - my OH and I don't always agree and that brings its own difficulties, also treating - I know John uses these very selectively and I think that's important - again, spoken with the benefit of hindsight - I've overdone the treating at times and now having to rewind on that too. I feel that the way we live today, sometimes we want quick results, that's certainly not happening with lab pup training. Stick at it, most adult Labradors are gorgeous, calm obedient dogs 😍
 
1 - 4 of 4 Posts
Top