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Discussion Starter #1
Last night I couldn't sleep so found myself at my PC googling labradors (as if I don't think about them enough I have to do it at 2am :roll: ). I have no idea how I found the following dog, and I'm certain his name and maybe his photo below must have cropped up on here many a time, but I'd never seen him before, and I have fallen in love!

Knaith Banjo - 1946 Dual Champion


Now I haven't posted his photo to start the 'ol debate on working v show etc etc but to ask what people genuinely think of him. Is he a moderate lab? In the middle of what our breed throws? Does he have enough bone and substance to appeal to those who like bigger labs but yet enough athleticism to keep the workers happy? Could he, if alive today, bridge that gap?

And lastly, out of pure interest, who here has this dog way, way, way back in their pedigree, what did he later throw?
 

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He is a beauty of course! Yes to my eye he is in the middle of our breed. A substantial working bred dog, with many of the typical structural points of good working bred dogs, such as no exaggeration in rear angulation - seriously good feet and given to a fraction MORE length of muzzle than lenght of skull....

He would not make up in the showring today I would seriously doubt, but then with the advancement in standard of our working events he may well not gain his FT Ch title either... you can just never know. He has real presence to me. Absolutely adequate bone. He does have a few minor structural points that would have me shot at dawn if I mentioned them as he is so adored.... but overall balance and just ... well...a beauty ;-)

Di
 

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If the KC pulls towards 'fit for purpose' etc etc is there any chance a dog like this in the future may receive a compliment in the Show Ring in the distant future? Take your point also that by today's standards, likewise he may not attain any awards in the field either.

However, I'm glad both you Di and you Miley like him. To me he's pretty perfect. Does anyone here who likes the more substantial lab or the reverse, see anything to like in him too?
 

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" If the KC pulls towards 'fit for purpose' etc etc is there any chance a dog like this in the future may receive a compliment in the Show Ring in the distant future? "

Possibly.... who knows how it is all going to 'go' we do seem at some kind of crossroads right now. I don't forsee huge radical change taking place though. Lots of small positive ones. But then most dogs in the ring aren't hugely overdone creatures to my mind, a lot is made of them being so but really there are some beautiful dogs being shown. They may not physcially be in *serious* working condition (and that goes for mine too before anyone pouts), but the structure is not at fault, they structurally could do a great days work.

Di
 

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Discussion Starter #6
Diana said:
" but really there are some beautiful dogs being shown. They may not physcially be in *serious* working condition (and that goes for mine too before anyone pouts), but the structure is not at fault, they structurally could do a great days work.

Di
That is good to hear. So some are not too far from him? Although why should the dog above be THE benchmark anyway just because I like him a LOT :wink:

But mostly I ask because he seems to have it all, beauty and ability and in abundance. I would be as proud to show him off in a ring as I would in the shooting field.
 

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I love him. My father used him several times and I will dig deep to see if I can find any pics.
On the other side - for me looks are not the important bit, athough I don't want a downright ugly dog or a string bean.
For me the ability to get the job done has to come first.
I like a dog with a strong character with plenty of vim - not a slow coach.
Something that is not boring to train and is going to test me at every turn.
Good looks are a bonus.
If I could choose then this dog WOULD be my ideal in look.
I am with you there Helen.
Sherry
 

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He looks great, I'd be very glad of a dog like this for deer work. I just love looking at the old pictures, have you anymore?
 

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There are more recent European based but UK bred dual champions (sadly now deceased).

Carromer's Charlie Chalk springs to mind. My Bluebie's great grand pa!
 

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barney2007 said:
And lastly, out of pure interest, who here has this dog way, way, way back in their pedigree, what did he later throw?
I think you will find he sits behind a massive number of current dogs from pet, show and working breeding. I know he certainly sits behind all my dogs and we have some quite diverse breeding here.

I just did a quick descendents check in my Breedmate database and he is sitting behind over 10K of the dogs there - and I suspect many more which are not being picked up because of the missing links in the pedigrees rather than because he is not there.

What is fascinating when you start looking right at the back at the pedigrees (we are talking 60+ generations here) - they all go back to the same small handful of dogs.
 

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Do you know he looks like the type of dog I remember labs to be as a little girl - the type of dog I fell in love with and probably why many years after I have labvs now.
 

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Maybe it's just the way he's standing in the photo, but he seems to have a slightly too small head for his body to me (from an very ignorant point of view!)
Other than that minor detail (!), he looks very nice.

Becs
 

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It’s a great picture Helen, featured in Lorna Countess Howe’s book “The Popular Labrador Retriever” a must have book for any Labrador historian. Pictured, in my copy, above Dual Ch Staindrop Saighdear, who was featured in a recent edition of the Shooting Gazette, as one of the greats. I think they both look fantastic; proper dogs!

John
 

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He looks pretty much ok to me H, maybe a tad short coupled for my own preference, but that could well be the angle of the photograph.

He also has a bottom line, which many of the show dogs I look at on here (it's the only place I see them), don't have, they just look square.

A nice dog, as is Staindrop Saighdear, I saw the article John mentioned in the SG, as was impressed by his looks as well.

Andrew
 
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