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Discussion Starter #1
Just a note to everyone who helped me researching hip score records, and / or who may be interested to know. I have purchased from the Kennel Club their records of all Labrador's hip scored to date, and I can truthfully say that Oak is the first dog, ever, since records began, to score 0:0 hips with both parents also scoring 0:0!! There are a number of dogs where one parent is 0:0 and produces 0:0, but Oak is the first to have BOTH parents!

It doesn't change the fact that he is still, and will always be, my beloved Oak, my friend and playmate, but it does perhaps show that generations of careful breeding (Oak is 4th generation 0:0) is paying off. I wonder if this is something which would interest breeders, and if so, is there is any publication that I could write to and tell them this?

If any of you want to know anything about hip records, I have the info now and can look it up for you (subject to the K C restrictions I had to sign when purchasing the file).

Best wishes

Katy
 

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Discussion Starter #5
Thanks all of you! I'm very chuffed having had the confirmation now that he is indeed a dog of a lifetime, and now I can tell EVERYONE!!!! (And be terribly boring on the subject!!!)

Yes, Mambos Mum, I hope to breed from him one day, but not yet - he is only 15 months and has a lot of growing up and learning to do before he is ready for marriage!

Katy
 

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That is such a wonderful achievement.

It will be really interesting to follow it and see if it can be replicated further.

Hattie has come back 2/2, which is not as good, I know, but it is lower than both her parents. I am really interested to see if I can maintain that lower score through careful breeding.

I do think that there is so much more to this than we can understand, but as a complete numptie in genetics, I would have thought that the gene for HD is not in this line, so the only problems that may occur, have to stem from environmental factors, so this line is a wonderful 'research' line.

Hayley
 

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Will wait with interest to see if the 0/0 line can continue and how long before it becomes the norm. I suppose that really is the aim ultimately?

Marianne
 

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I guess that if you keep breeding only from very low scoring parents , low scores SHOULD be attainable genetically even if then environmental issues come into play and force them up. Or am I completely barking up the wrong tree?

Marianne
 

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Discussion Starter #9
I am no expert at all, but from what I can see obviously low scoring parents, grandparents etc is a very strong aid, but it is by no means a guarantee of getting a good result in all the next generation. There must be other influences, aside from environmental ones, which cause a less favourable result. I am sure you are aware that a member on here had a huge disappointment recently when a dog she had bought in, from good scoring parents, and had nutured in every way, had a poor hip score. No amount of study has establish the reason for that.

So, yes, obviously the sort of news I am sharing with you is very exciting in the search towards the perfect genetic Labrador hips. But, I suspect, it is one factor of many towards to the aim of the perfect hip, not the sole factor. Plus, of course, we should never forget that there are many good dogs with poor hips, who are bred from and produce offspring with good hips. To mere mortals like me it's all very confusing indeed!

Well done with Hettie's 2:2's, that is a very nice score indeed to have!

Katy
 

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Well done on Hatties 2.2

Thank you :D

Sue has done so much research into this and the level of improvement. I am not sure of the statistics, but hip scores have not come down as much as you would think, or like.

Good hip scoring parents do not always produce good hip scoring off spring, but this line is doing just that. If I were a geneticist, I would be so interested to follow the line further. Therefore giving a much better incite as to the other problems we may be causing. Be it environmental, or nutritional.

Wonderful news.

Hayley
 

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Wow that is great news 8) .
I think that the AHT may be interested in those stats if you fancy letting them use his dna for the hip research pm me and I will let you have the email address of the person concerned . :D
 

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Discussion Starter #13
Thanks - I will pm you. Would be very happy to aid any research which may shed more light on hip genetics.

Many thanks

Katy
 

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Discussion Starter #14
duinhorst said:
KMH said:
(Oak is 4th generation 0:0)
Very good :!:
And there are already results from the siblings ?
One sibling has scored total of 7. That is all so far. I have, with help, compiled a list of all siblings and scores of parents, grandparents and great grandparents - if anyone would like to see it out of interest I can email it to you if you pm me your email address.

Katy
 

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Congrats Katy, as you know I am thrilled for the pair of you, and Oaks breeder.

I wonder, with all the talk of the 'unexpected' being round the corner with hip scoring, despite using desireable practice - so low to low, what the statistics would show about consistant single figure matings (or there abouts by a point or two) to single figure matings. They appear to have been the area personally I've found to be the most consistant through my own and 'close to me' folks breeding practice, but i'm sure it would be wayyyy too complicated to run it through what you have now in terms of records...?

Di
 

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Brilliant!!!!
 

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Discussion Starter #18
Diana said:
Congrats Katy, as you know I am thrilled for the pair of you, and Oaks breeder.

I wonder, with all the talk of the 'unexpected' being round the corner with hip scoring, despite using desireable practice - so low to low, what the statistics would show about consistant single figure matings (or there abouts by a point or two) to single figure matings. They appear to have been the area personally I've found to be the most consistant through my own and 'close to me' folks breeding practice, but i'm sure it would be wayyyy too complicated to run it through what you have now in terms of records...?

Di
Di, I am sure it would be possible - but may be WELL beyond my computer and maths skills!!! However one evening when I am not dashing about dog training (don't hold your breath!), I will certainly have a good look at this. Or, next time I see you, you are very welcome to borrow the disc!!!

Katy
 

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... runs scared waving hands.... ;-) I'm not that desperate to know ;-) I just have found none of this 'grey area' seems to occur so much less if for two, three or four generations one sticks to matings single didget scores. Its not always possible of COURSE, but by golly it seems to not throw up the lottery that everything else reportedly does.... There again maybe it DOES, and mostly those I know have just been 'lucky', but seems something sound in doing so... something *pretty* reliable...

Di
 
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