Posted: Sat Feb 04, 2012 4:03 pm Post subject: Cruciate Ligament - Surgery or not?? HELP
Hi All
My Choc Lab Charlie is 2 years old.
After a walk I noticed he was limping on his back right leg, I monitored for a bit and then took to the vet. The Vet said to rest and do short walks to see how he gets on.
After a couple of week Charlie had a little set back and went back to limping so took him back to the vets who wanted to xray him. After xrays the vet said its his cruciate ligament that is damaged, he put him on Rimadyl tablets and said to rest, limit him to short lead walks and do hyrdrotherapy. So we did this and for around 6 weeks his walks slightly increased and there was no limping, he did 4 hydro sessions and increased from 5mins to 10mins and was doing great!! Here is the big BUT
He saw a little dog whilst on a walk and jumped around, which I stopped immediatley but it was too late he was back to limping. Called the vets who said let me see him (of course) he then said i think its time Charlie saw an orthopaedic specialist to find out whats going on and maybe discuss surgery.
So I have an appointment booked for the specialist, Im just worried that the specialist will try sell me the Operation rather than whats best for Charlie.
He is still limping and anything over a walk he occasionally carries the leg.
My question is do I start the rest & hyrdo again or do I go for surgery?
Totally gutted we havent been able to go on a decent walk months!
I would love some advice from people who have been in my position and come out the other side.
Sorry but no one can answer your question without knowing exactly how bad things are.
You probably know all this, but just in case you dont, I'll explain. What we call the Cruciate ligament is in fact two ligaments, the Cranial ligament and the Caudal Ligament. These two form a cross, (Hence Cruciate) securing the Femur to the Tibia.
Damage can vary from a slight tear to completely separated, so treatment would depend on the degree of damage, and only the specialist will be able to tell you that. If it is severe then it is an operation without the option. Otherwise it is rest, and that means complete rest,cage rest and lead walking IN YOUR GARDEN ONLY for toilet purposes. The injury is that serious.
Yeh I understand that, my problem is will the specialist try sell me the operation so they can make money or will they choose the best for Charlie?
Im on saying this as Ive read some things on the internet stating I need to be careful with specialists as they are a business and will try get you to go for the operation to get money out of you.
I dont want to go for the operation if rest & hyrdo will work but not sure how I will find this out.
I dont want to go for the operation if rest & hyrdo will work but not sure how I will find this out.
That's the problem, isn't it. You are never going to be able to find out without seeing a Specialist and by doing nothing, you are risking the dog's condition getting markedly worse.
I think the only logical thing you can do, is get a referral to a Specialist your vet trusts or one you know other people have used and recommend. Have a chat with them and get a feel for them. If you feel you are being strung along, then don't go ahead with the op and find another Specialist for a second opinion. If you do feel comfortable with them and their advise, then do whatever they suggest.
I would say in this instance though, doing nothing isn't really an option.
It's a shame you aren't further south, as I'd recommend the Specialist I took my Lab to, to anyone (Noel Fitzpatrick if anyone is interested). He only did what he felt was necessary and never did the more expensive reconstructive surgery he could have done, just for the money.
A good specialist should give you all the options - you are well within your rights to request a 2nd opinion from another specialist should you wish although this will probably be at your own cost.
I don't want to doubt your vet but sometimes problems with joints can be difficult to diagnose - I would always push for a specialist's opinion.
My Luna was given the 'probably going to get ED and HD because she's a lab but everything seems ok at the moment' diagnosis by 5/6 different vets before I got her to a specialist, his xrays showed and diagnosed ED in her elbows, she had an arthroscopy on her left elbow the same day and because I requested hip xrays to 'just in case' found her right hip is partially dislocated.
Dogs recover well and relatively quickly from ops, personally, I would always want to have all the options clear in my head before making a decision with how to proceed, specialists will understand this too, I would hope.
The specialist I took Luna too was aware that Luna's elbows wouldn't be covered under insurance because of a history of front leg limping prior to the insurance being taken out - I don't feel he would complete any unnecessary work on her as he knows that I am paying from my own pockets and it is obvious to him that they aren't deep!
I would also try to get an exact, or as exact as possible, diagnosis of what has actually happened with the cruciate, is it torn or stretched, or completely ruptured.
My bitch Indie tore, then ruptured the anterior cruciate in her left knee a few years ago when she was about 18 months old, she had surgery twice, once to repair the knee, the second to repair a meniscus pad.
When she ruptured her cruciate her leg was dangling like it was broken for several days, would have been less except for the vet I was with at the time failed to have her accurately diagnosed and treated in time, so I switched vets. Her operation has been pretty successful, she's now 6 1/2 and although she's been a bit stiff in the cold weather recently, she's not doing too badly.
Peppa's had a cruciate repair just before she was one. I didn't get her until she was nearly two, so wasn't involved with her at the time.
There are several orthopaedic specialists around our area, but Snowie's is Chris May at Northwest Surgeons. I can recommend him without hesitation. When Snowie was about to have a hip replacement, Chris halted because there was a suspicion about her weight loss. She quickly became very ill with auto-immune problems and the hip replacement can now never take place due to her drug regime. Chris and his team have the utmost integrity, and you can be sure that you can trust them to only ever do what is in the best interests of the dog.
My second dog had a ruptured cruciate at aged 2. She had a repair done not by any specialist by my local vet and lived to a happy old age when she finally passed away from a brain tumour.
Do non-specialists not do this type of op in the Uk now?
Ive heard good reports and a friend of mine is a nurse there and she says the results from the ops are really good. She also said the vets there wont push me to choose the op because of money if the op isnt needed. I think I will just have to see whats said on Tuesday.
When booking the appointment they said when you attend if the vet decides he needs surgery we will keep him in then do the surgery the next day. eeek a bit soon isnt it?
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