Posted: Mon Jun 18, 2007 9:30 am Post subject: Re: Puppy Farming
Sonia wrote:
Who buys from these farms amd why? How do they hear about them? Are they cheaper? Why do the government allow these farms to continue?
Just a few thoughts:
"How do they hear about them?"
Near where I live, I regularly drive passed "farms" with signs outside advertising various breeds of pups for sale. I would also presume they advertise in the local free ads etc?
"Who buys from these farms amd why?"
I would suggest a lot of people buy from these places not actually knowing they are buying from a puppy farm? I could be wrong, but I have always assumed there are varying degrees of "puppy farms" and they not be obviously "puppy farms" to the uneducated buyer? ie I doubt you would walk in and see hundreds of puppies for sale, I would have thought it would be presented in a "clever" way?
Also, I suspect a lot of people don't know the difference between a breeder set-up and a puppy-farm set-up?
I would think a lot of people who buy from puppy farms are unable to get a pup elsewhere? Perhaps they do not meet the criteria of rescue centres or top breeders (ie work full time etc) and they see the free ads as the only place they can turn to to get a pup?
"Why do the government allow these farms to continue?"
God only knows - and it is not just allowing them to continue, it is actively encouraging it in some cases (some welsh farmers were given government grants to "diversify" - even if they "diversified" into puppy farming).
I know someone that brought a pup from a puppy farm, she was a novice and didnt even know she had. She saw the ad in a free ads paper, they where advitersing three or four other breeds ( to me thats a dead give away)
When she went there she wasnt shown the mum only a choice of pups( again another sign)
The place where she got er pup from was a working farm, and although she could hear plenty of dogs barking she just assumed it they had a lot of dogs.
When it really hit home was when she was told by a number of people that it sounds like a puppy farm, so she did somoe research into what looked like a wonderful pedigree, only to find the sire who was a champion had died 2 years before her pup was born. I am not sure how they manged that, as i dont know if the kennel club is nottified of deaths.
The puppy farms here label themselves and advertise as pet / puppy farms (eg ericson puppy farm)
They generally never let you see the parents and have up to 20 breeds on display. I went to look at one to see the conditions
Many of them double as boarding kennels here
Still people buy from them.
There is also a spate of thefts of up to 10 or 20 pups from the farms. Sceptics think this is an insurance job so they can claim for unsold pups (and dispose of them)
I am very naive because I had no idea they existed on any scale in the UK.
Aw more sad stories from Sarah poor little mites - they don't stand a chance do they?
I must say that while I know of puppy farms being in existence and would never buy from one, I think it's because I have some doggie friends who gave me advice on not buying from them and also because I did some research which I lot of people don't do I think also many people think they're helping the puppies by taking them away from the farm I'd want to take all of them home if I saw them
I agree about the fine line between commercial breedin and puppy farming but feel the need to defend my breeder as he has springers and labs and had several litters when we got Tobes. I met all the parents of all the puppies and was very pleased with the setup. I suppose he would be called a commercial breeder by some but I don't think he would be classed as a puppy-farmer...(don't mean to offend so please don't take it that way- just expressing my opinion )
I once asked the question on another forum, "What is YOUR definition of a puppy farm?" Look at it this way. If you want to ban something first you must define what it is that you want to ban, and that is not easy. What laws can you bring to bear to ban them? Would puppies come under the same laws as Lambs for example? If not, why not? There are so many similar questions which need to be answered.
Yes, it's easy to see the worst cases of puppy farming, and the laws are already in place to close them down. It happens every day. But everything is by degrees and at what point does a large scale breeder become a puppy farmer? Or is size alone nothing to do with it?
There, that should get you thinking. (The person on the other forum simply called me names and went away! I'm sure they thought I was argueiing in favour of puppy farming!!!)
yes it does raise a lot of questions and as the law simply sees dogs as "possessions" just like a car or washing machine (not sure Toby would agree with them though!) I can see your point re: lambs and other farm animals
I guess it'll change over time - but maybe decades rather than years?...
My answer to that would be simple - any individual or organisation who keeps dogs for the sole purpose of breeding them for financial gain.
Vicki
Sorry, maybe I should elaborate on that. When I think of a puppy farm, I think of dogs being kept in kennels for 24/7 - or at least 23/7. I think of little human interaction for the dogs - just being provided with the basic necessities of food, water and shelter. I think of the dogs not being walked, not being played with. These dogs have no life, they exist as a commodity and as money-making machines, no more than that.
Personally speaking, if we are talking about exact definitions, I would suggest that any premise on which more than 5 litters a year are produced is a puppy farm, albeit on varying scales.
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